Nolva/Clomid Questions

Watcher · 08-18-2005, 03:36 PM

When beginning PCT what are the best times to take Nolva and Clomid?

In the morning, at night, both, and do I take them with a meal or on an empty stomach?

Also, what's the difference between liquid Clomid and powder Clomid? I thought CNW had liquid Clomid, or at least they used to, but now all I see is the powder form? Any idea how to admister that or it is just best to find a research site that has liquid such as AGguys?

Also, there's no need for any 6OXO, RXT, or any OTC anti estrogen is there if you are taking Nolva/Clomid correct?

**Fireproof** · 08-18-2005, 03:47 PM

As far as Clomid vs. Nolva, I would go with Nolva. I know there
are folks that swear by Clomid, but I've read a fair amount about the
two, and would choose Nolva for your anti-estrogen (SERM).

William Llewellyn sums it up nicely here:

[quote = Llewellyn]

<div ="pageer"> Conclusion </div>

To summarize the above research succinctly, Nolvadex is the more purely
anti-estrogenic of the two drugs, at least where the HPTA
(Hypothalamic-Pituitary-Testicular Axis) is concerned. This fact
enables Nolvadex to offer the male bodybuilder certain advantages over
Clomid. This is especially true at times when we are looking to restore
a balanced HPTA, and would not want to desensitize the pituitary to
GnRH. This could perhaps slow recovery to some extent, as the pituitary
would require higher amounts of hypothalamic GnRH in the presence of
Clomid in order to get the same level of LH stimulation.

Nolvadex also seems preferred from long-term use, for those who find
anti-estrogens effective enough at raising testosterone levels to
warrant using as anabolics. Here Nolvadex would seem to provide a
better and more stable increase in testosterone levels, and likely will
offer a similar or greater effect than Clomid for considerably less
money. The potential rise in SHBG levels with Clomid, supported by
other research (3), is also cause for concern, as this might work to
allow for comparably less free active testosterone compared to Nolvadex
as well. Ultimately both drugs are effective anti-estrogens for the
prevention of gyno and elevation of endogenous testosterone, however
the above research provides enough evidence for me to choose Nolvadex
every time.[/quote]

Link to the full article right here - just click me!

So, given that, I would get Nolva from CNW. They offer powder and
liquid. Liquid is easiest to administer for your "research
project". You could do powder, but you'd either have to get a
solvent to mix your own liquid, or a precise measuring scale to cap
your own one by one (what a pain).

TMack40 · 08-18-2005, 05:10 PM

I would dose it in the evening when estrogen levels will naturally be at their peak. As far as taking with meals or on an empty stomach, probably not a big difference either way. Def won't need any otc anti-e's with the nolva. Did you post what cycle ran you ran anywhere else, or is everything still in planning?

floods · 08-18-2005, 05:21 PM

You WILL need something like RXT, ATD, 6-OXO (last resort IMO) to boost your natural test levels back up post-cycle. The Nolva/Clomid will take care of circulating estrogen but your test levels will still be at rock bottom. I agree with FP, go with Nolva. . .remember, I'll make you cry if you choose Clomid

Watcher · 08-18-2005, 05:50 PM

Fireproof - Great article, very noteworthy information.

TMack - Running an 8 Weeker of MethylBol/4AD at high doses and will most likely string out the 4AD for another 2-4 weeks past the 8 weeks of MBol (M1-4ADD). I'm in the middle of week 4 right now and can tell that the shutdown is in effect and the water retention is on the rise. By the time 8-12 weeks rolls around I know for sure I will be bottomed out. I have a full bottle of Nolva, Milk Thistle,and a bottle of 6-OXO on hand for emergencies and post cycle.

Rev - So you're saying that if I were to take Nolva/Clomid post cycle I would still want to take RXT or a similar product in order to get the boys back to working order again? I was under the impression that you didn't need an OTC if you were taking Nolva/Clomid together.

SteveO · 08-18-2005, 07:50 PM

nolva + clomid combo, don't be a cheap ass on your gains

Watcher · 08-18-2005, 08:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SteveO

nolva + clomid combo, don't be a cheap ass on your gains

Hey SteveO, I accidently erased the PM you sent me a while back with the schedule for Nolva/Clomid in it.

Is there anyway you could share it with the rest of us so we can use it as a reference in the future?

Thanks bro, and as always, you're help and advice is priceless!!

Also, where do you purchase yours at?

SteveO · 08-18-2005, 09:43 PM

Not a whole lot, finally finishing up school about to get going with fire school after this.

PCT is gonna vary person to person and what you decide to run. I
recommend atleast a 6 week PCT for a longer cycle (12 weeks) with
dosages somewhere in the range of

week 1

60mg nolva

300mg clomid

I'm not gonna give out a number for clen, because everyone responds
differently. 100mcg is sufficient for almost anyone though.
Trial and error, start low and work your way up

week 2

60mg nolva

100mg clomid

week 3

40mg nolva

100mg clomid

week 4

20mg nolva

50mg clomid

week 5 and 6, repeat week 4

Clen is a great thing to have for post cycle, but make sure you look
into the side effects of it. It's a very dangerous chemical
and can do lots of harm to the heart. I've heard reports of CHF
(congestive heart failure), skipping heart beats, and the dreaded CLEN
SHAKE! If you haven't taken it before, you wouldn't understand

2 bottles of nolva

2 bottes of clomid

1 bottle of clen should be sufficient

Oh and I get mine from ibenutrition.com

Edited by: SteveO

SteveO · 08-18-2005, 09:45 PM

any longer than 12 weeks you should look into getting some HCG

Watcher · 08-18-2005, 11:58 PM

Excellent SteveO, and thanks for the link. Those prices are outstanding bro!!

rgkfit · 08-19-2005, 11:07 AM

Personally, I think 60 mg. of nolva per is a bit too much. I would suggest 40 per day the first 2 weeks, and then drop it down to 20.

I also do not believe you should need Clomid....there are sides to Clomid as posted, but again, I only see folks who are doing AAS's doing Clomid, and it may be overkill.

Nolva and 6 oxo along with Milk Thistle should do the trick. HCG is something to think about if your boys are really shrunken. But even this I would do only if you deem it necessary.

Watcher · 03-15-2007, 06:38 PM

Bump for great information

koz1181 · 09-29-2008, 11:32 AM

i start all pct with hcg 500iu e5d (for a month) along with 20mg nolva and 100mg clomid ed for 2months all together..onside from that i always have tribulus and zma...maybe some clen but i dont like clen..anyway after the cycle i also stop consuming high carbs and consume more monansaturated fats and saturated fats..i also use the 2on 1 off 2on 2 off work out protocol after cycle...i lower the intensity of my work outs also..thats all you need to know

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08-18-2005, 03:36 PM	#1
Watcher Heavyweight Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Loveland, Colorado Age: 30 Posts: 4,688 Friends: (30) Referrals: 3	When beginning PCT what are the best times to take Nolva and Clomid? In the morning, at night, both, and do I take them with a meal or on an empty stomach? Also, what's the difference between liquid Clomid and powder Clomid? I thought CNW had liquid Clomid, or at least they used to, but now all I see is the powder form? Any idea how to admister that or it is just best to find a research site that has liquid such as AGguys? Also, there's no need for any 6OXO, RXT, or any OTC anti estrogen is there if you are taking Nolva/Clomid correct?

08-18-2005, 03:47 PM	#2
Fireproof The Chief Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Frisco, TX Age: 41 Posts: 13,387 Friends: (62) Referrals: 29	As far as Clomid vs. Nolva, I would go with Nolva. I know there are folks that swear by Clomid, but I've read a fair amount about the two, and would choose Nolva for your anti-estrogen (SERM). William Llewellyn sums it up nicely here: [quote = Llewellyn] <div ="pageer"> Conclusion </div> To summarize the above research succinctly, Nolvadex is the more purely anti-estrogenic of the two drugs, at least where the HPTA (Hypothalamic-Pituitary-Testicular Axis) is concerned. This fact enables Nolvadex to offer the male bodybuilder certain advantages over Clomid. This is especially true at times when we are looking to restore a balanced HPTA, and would not want to desensitize the pituitary to GnRH. This could perhaps slow recovery to some extent, as the pituitary would require higher amounts of hypothalamic GnRH in the presence of Clomid in order to get the same level of LH stimulation. Nolvadex also seems preferred from long-term use, for those who find anti-estrogens effective enough at raising testosterone levels to warrant using as anabolics. Here Nolvadex would seem to provide a better and more stable increase in testosterone levels, and likely will offer a similar or greater effect than Clomid for considerably less money. The potential rise in SHBG levels with Clomid, supported by other research (3), is also cause for concern, as this might work to allow for comparably less free active testosterone compared to Nolvadex as well. Ultimately both drugs are effective anti-estrogens for the prevention of gyno and elevation of endogenous testosterone, however the above research provides enough evidence for me to choose Nolvadex every time.[/quote] Link to the full article right here - just click me! So, given that, I would get Nolva from CNW. They offer powder and liquid. Liquid is easiest to administer for your "research project". You could do powder, but you'd either have to get a solvent to mix your own liquid, or a precise measuring scale to cap your own one by one (what a pain).

08-18-2005, 05:10 PM	#3
TMack40 Cosby Team Triosby Gem Swap Champion! Join Date: Apr 2005 Age: 27 Posts: 474 Friends: (4) Referrals: 0	I would dose it in the evening when estrogen levels will naturally be at their peak. As far as taking with meals or on an empty stomach, probably not a big difference either way. Def won't need any otc anti-e's with the nolva. Did you post what cycle ran you ran anywhere else, or is everything still in planning?

08-18-2005, 05:21 PM	#4
floods ἐξαιρέω Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Republic of Texas Age: 100 Posts: 4,817 Friends: (35) Referrals: 1	You WILL need something like RXT, ATD, 6-OXO (last resort IMO) to boost your natural test levels back up post-cycle. The Nolva/Clomid will take care of circulating estrogen but your test levels will still be at rock bottom. I agree with FP, go with Nolva. . .remember, I'll make you cry if you choose Clomid

08-18-2005, 05:50 PM	#5
Watcher Heavyweight Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Loveland, Colorado Age: 30 Posts: 4,688 Friends: (30) Referrals: 3	Fireproof - Great article, very noteworthy information. TMack - Running an 8 Weeker of MethylBol/4AD at high doses and will most likely string out the 4AD for another 2-4 weeks past the 8 weeks of MBol (M1-4ADD). I'm in the middle of week 4 right now and can tell that the shutdown is in effect and the water retention is on the rise. By the time 8-12 weeks rolls around I know for sure I will be bottomed out. I have a full bottle of Nolva, Milk Thistle,and a bottle of 6-OXO on hand for emergencies and post cycle. Rev - So you're saying that if I were to take Nolva/Clomid post cycle I would still want to take RXT or a similar product in order to get the boys back to working order again? I was under the impression that you didn't need an OTC if you were taking Nolva/Clomid together.

08-18-2005, 07:50 PM	#6
SteveO Lightweight Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: 1 Posts: 162 Friends: (0) Referrals: 0	nolva + clomid combo, don't be a cheap ass on your gains

08-18-2005, 09:43 PM	#8
SteveO Lightweight Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: 1 Posts: 162 Friends: (0) Referrals: 0	Not a whole lot, finally finishing up school about to get going with fire school after this. PCT is gonna vary person to person and what you decide to run. I recommend atleast a 6 week PCT for a longer cycle (12 weeks) with dosages somewhere in the range of week 1 60mg nolva 300mg clomid I'm not gonna give out a number for clen, because everyone responds differently. 100mcg is sufficient for almost anyone though. Trial and error, start low and work your way up week 2 60mg nolva 100mg clomid week 3 40mg nolva 100mg clomid week 4 20mg nolva 50mg clomid week 5 and 6, repeat week 4 Clen is a great thing to have for post cycle, but make sure you look into the side effects of it. It's a very dangerous chemical and can do lots of harm to the heart. I've heard reports of CHF (congestive heart failure), skipping heart beats, and the dreaded CLEN SHAKE! If you haven't taken it before, you wouldn't understand 2 bottles of nolva 2 bottes of clomid 1 bottle of clen should be sufficient Oh and I get mine from ibenutrition.com Edited by: SteveO

08-18-2005, 09:45 PM	#9
SteveO Lightweight Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: 1 Posts: 162 Friends: (0) Referrals: 0	any longer than 12 weeks you should look into getting some HCG

08-18-2005, 11:58 PM	#10
Watcher Heavyweight Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Loveland, Colorado Age: 30 Posts: 4,688 Friends: (30) Referrals: 3	Excellent SteveO, and thanks for the link. Those prices are outstanding bro!!

08-19-2005, 11:07 AM	#11
rgkfit Middleweight Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: 255 Posts: 977 Friends: (0) Referrals: 0	Personally, I think 60 mg. of nolva per is a bit too much. I would suggest 40 per day the first 2 weeks, and then drop it down to 20. I also do not believe you should need Clomid....there are sides to Clomid as posted, but again, I only see folks who are doing AAS's doing Clomid, and it may be overkill. Nolva and 6 oxo along with Milk Thistle should do the trick. HCG is something to think about if your boys are really shrunken. But even this I would do only if you deem it necessary.

03-15-2007, 06:38 PM	#12
Watcher Heavyweight Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Loveland, Colorado Age: 30 Posts: 4,688 Friends: (30) Referrals: 3	Bump for great information

09-29-2008, 11:32 AM	#13
koz1181 Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: greece Posts: 3 Friends: (0) Referrals: 0	i start all pct with hcg 500iu e5d (for a month) along with 20mg nolva and 100mg clomid ed for 2months all together..onside from that i always have tribulus and zma...maybe some clen but i dont like clen..anyway after the cycle i also stop consuming high carbs and consume more monansaturated fats and saturated fats..i also use the 2on 1 off 2on 2 off work out protocol after cycle...i lower the intensity of my work outs also..thats all you need to know